John Seddon interviews Jim Lines and Dave Adams from Portsmouth City Council, September 2021.

Jim and Dave were mentored by Vanguard’s John Little and have since been self-sufficient. They have helped the curious recognise that a key aspect of the Vanguard Method is enabling the organisation to gradually become independent in its application of systems thinking.

Find out why the work has been so successful in Portsmouth, what all their interventions have in common and which tactics interventionists use to get leaders to lead.